Presented by Poppy Mullins
Pure Rumination with Poppy Mullins; a chat with Tori Brown on using drama to overcome dread.
This week I sit down with creative writing student, playwright, and filmmaker, Tori Brown, to discuss how she overcomes those dreadful moments of self-doubt on her creative journey.
This spring, ScratchThat is launching a new segment called ‘Pure Rumination’ with me, Poppy Mullins, a creative writing student with cerebral palsy. Today I am sitting here with second-year Bachelor of Fine Arts creative writing student, Tori Brown.
So, Tori, when did you first realise that you wanted to follow the creative pathway you are now on—from film, to drama, to now, creative writing? And was it a particular place or space you went to that gave you the confidence to pursue this?
Growing up, when I was doing the ‘suicide 6’ in high school while trying to become a doctor, I just felt very disimpassioned and disinterested. So, I went on a trip to England with my family and I became very enamoured with the arts. And I’d always loved writing stories, and I found my way into film, and it was during my film degree that I was like, I want to do something that’s just storytelling.
So, to just unpack that, what was it about the creative space you went to in England that attracted you?
I think it was being very distant from Australia; being able to separate myself from that community a bit and being a bit alone to self-reflect. And I loved my great uncle Kevin who we called ‘Grunkle Kevin’. He showed me a lot of films that I just grew very in love with, like Amélie and Pan’s Labyrinth—they’re very forming for me.
Were there any moments of self-doubt that you had about your abilities in your creative practice, particularly if you come from such a science-heavy and academic background. What places help you to push through and how did you push through?
I think two spaces that have helped me a lot are Uni as a whole [and] being with other people who have those same feelings. There are also the clubs like Literary Salon—being a part of the salon and hearing others speak is so vital to that growth and that feeling of self-doubt.
Is that need of being around others a big requirement for you?
Yeah, definitely. I think self-doubt often is bred in an area of loneliness. Like, if you only look at your work in a self-world, you look at it in your individual lens. You’re not going to see the greater picture. The truth is quality will come with outside perspective.
I think that need to be around others is something many ScratchThat readers are going to identify with. Do you have any specific moments where being around others didn’t help you in your creative practice?
Yeah. Well, I think for everyone it’s kind of hard to shake off self-doubt at any time. I feel like one of the first points that I had a feeling of my unique style as a writer was late in my first year when I was selected to read for the QUT Lit Salon. I’d been selected to read for the queer salon. It was funny because I had written that piece a while ago but reading that piece and getting off stage just felt like it was such a community of writers and that we all had something to say.
Had you been feeling dread before that moment of being selected? And then, how did that change?
So, I applied on the day that it was due, even though I had the story ready for ages. It’s tough to get picked. That night I was so nervous I was shaking on stage. And then when I left, it was just this depletion. And then everyone was like ‘That was good. That was great. I loved that story’. So, even though I had that little bit of self-doubt and dread beforehand, I ended up feeling like I’d said something worth saying.
Is the theatre room a space that inspires you?
I always find that having some time away from work is good. Taking in multiple different forms of entertainment or art really does help me to take a step back and I guess plagiarise as much as possible in my own works.
In an artistic sense then, what is it about these forms that keep you coming back to them?
I think it’s the layers and witticism in comedy that really attracts me. I love Community and Parks and Recreation. Even though it’s comedy, the characters are always taken care of. I just really think there is strength in strong characters and their characterization, for lack of a better word.
Often, they tell you not to try to imitate anyone else in your work. Thinking about your own work, what sort of features do you imitate and what effect does this have on your creative process?
I wouldn’t necessarily say I imitate what I’ve been watching, honestly. The art I love to consume is more of an escape from my own process, where it’s like I take a break and then I might draw on a certain idea. So, I guess more thematically, stuff comes up. I was struggling with a certain type of character in my play, and I stopped writing for a while and then I played this video game and then in the video game there was a metaphor for love that stuck with me. And I wrote it down and I thought about it. And then some version of that ended up morphing into a line in my play.
We are pushed into our little silos. Do you think there’s value in working with other practitioners from diverse creative industries?
Yes, definitely. I never imagined I would write plays, but when I saw the Vena Cava opportunity… [it was] a prompt on Instagram. It just felt like that story could be told in no other medium than a play. Different mediums are definitely there for us to bring something new to and explore, because not one story can be told in every medium. We have to step out of our own worlds because how else are we meant to grow as creatives?
Speaking to that, it would be better if Fine Arts all worked interchangeably. Especially in film.
Anyway, that’s something the next generation of ScratchThat can consider. What new spaces have opened up to you as a result of you becoming more involved in the writing side of things, and what influence has that had on your creative process?
That’s what the great thing about Uni is, learning new things and meeting new people and getting those new perspectives.
And were there any specific techniques you gained from experience in theatre and film that helped you to push through the fear of the blank, white page?
Well, I think film’s helpful since it’s not prose. It’s way quicker to write and you can dot point stories or just smash out a draft and then add to it later. And so, when I’ve gone back to prose writing, it’s difficult to get the word count! I think this year I’ve committed to writing more regularly and not allowing myself to delete. Then going over it, I can see what works, what doesn’t, what I can add from showing it to others. Nothing’s good in fifty words. It’s only good after five hundred words.
So, in terms of working in different creative writing fields, are there any techniques you’ve learnt from different mediums about how to create strong characters.
I’ll get like certain snippets of the story out and then fill in the blanks in between.
So, would you say that the character forms around the narrative arc?
Yes. All stories are dependent on strong characters, and they’re very much about character journey and if you can figure out what the journey is, you find the character.
Based on the readings that you’ve done, has there been a technique from that public interface that has spilled over into your writing practice?
You might create art by yourself and putting it out to the world is like, is this gonna work? And so just showing it to a random group of strangers is helpful because you can find that you might write for yourself, but someone can relate to it. Just, the whole creative writing community is important. I’ve submitted to so many places and you get a lot of rejections, but eventually you do get acceptance and that’s so helpful.
I think a lot of ScratchThat readers would enjoy hearing about your decision to submit as you develop your creative practice, so thank you for sharing that. My next question is: you’ve written plays and films… what’s next on your horizon?
If I could break into editing that would be great. But yeah, I’d love to write a book, I guess. It would be a coming-of-age work talking about the expectations that girls have to have between being successful in their career and also having a family. I was talking to my partner and boys don’t have to grow up with that.
I wish you the best of luck in your creative future, Tori. Before you go, now that we have finished the serious stuff, what’s one book, one piece of music, and one film that you return to for comfort or inspiration in your creative practice?
I made a little list on the way over here. I love The Stranger by Albert Camus, that was one of the most formative books for me. For music, I would have to say Billy Joel’s ‘Vienna’, as the idea of slowing down brings me comfort when I feel stuck in the writing process. There’s this one quote from Dead Poets Society which encourages me to get my work out there: “You must strive to find your own voice, and the longer you wait to begin, the less likely you are to find it at all.”
Once again, I thank you, Tori, for joining me here at ScratchThat today, for a touch of pure rumination [laughs].
Thanks for having me here today, Poppy.
Poppy Mullins (she/her) is a writer of disability-focused Gothic fiction. She is creator and presenter of interview program Pure Rumination for 4ZZZ’s Incubatorzzz, found on the Zed Digital platform. Poppy is currently in her third year of a Creative Writing degree at QUT. She resides in Brisbane. Follow her on Instagram @poppy_bloss
Tori Brown (she/her) is a queer Meanjin-based writer, filmmaker, and musician. Currently working as QUT Literary Salon’s Media Manager whilst studying a Bachelor of Fine Arts (Creative Writing) at QUT. She has been published in Glass Magazine and spends her time gazing in to the abyss. None of her works would be possible without the immense emotional support of her cat and the power of caffeine. Follow her on Instagram @__niwatori__
Edited by: David Uptin and Elly LaRoche